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Please tell me you're not about to wreck my joy of contribution in yet another wiki with your customary and pedantic need to order all things to your liking. I'm gone forever from a now largely lifeless Andromeda site, and I would massively appreciate not being trailed around here. {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 15:32, April 27, 2014 (UTC)

The Andromeda wikia is not lifeless, edits have been made since your departure. I added to the SAS trivia, I did not remove your information.Syalantillesfel (talk) 15:38, April 27, 2014 (UTC)

With your usual attention to detail you have overlooked my use of the term 'largely lifeless', which an average of under one edit per day including messages would appear to me to constitute. {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 15:46, April 27, 2014 (UTC)

Basic courtesyEdit

Please could you stop diving in before I've had the chance to check my own handiwork. Give it at least ten minutes, please, as I am sometimes in the middle of a longer process and your additions cause edit conflicts. {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 23:40, May 1, 2014 (UTC)

Whatever elseEdit

We're certainly reinvigorating this wiki. :) {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 00:31, May 2, 2014 (UTC)

As this place needs tidying and sortingEdit

I was thinking about putting in a bid to adopt with Community Central, but it now strikes me that we might be able to do so together, and request to be both made Admins/Bcrats. Any opinion? {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 01:02, May 2, 2014 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea. But first we should ask the below admin for admin status.

Syalantillesfel (talk) 01:09, May 2, 2014 (UTC)


At the moment I'm trying to move things out of the general "Locations" category to more specific places. Why did you change this from "Cities" to "Locations"? {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 18:07, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

I am moving the cities from "cities" to "locations on X". Since Paradiso named no moon or planet I moved it to the general locations category. Syalantillesfel (talk) 18:09, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

If there's a specified moon or planet, great, but can't we leave the cities without that in the "Cities" category? {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}}

There are only 2 cities left with no specific locations.Syalantillesfel (talk) 18:19, May 3, 2014 (UTC)


Should we just consider them "Educational institutions"? It's not like there are so many as to really need a sub-category. {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 18:37, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

The museums have been placed in the Locations on Londinium category. Syalantillesfel (talk) 18:39, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

Category:Law enforcementEdit

This is currently empty. Should such as the courts go there, do you think? {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 18:40, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

No, I believe that the law enforcement topics do not need additional categories. Syalantillesfel (talk) 18:43, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

The category was created a long time ago by someone else but is currently empty, if you want to put Federal marshals or such in it. {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 18:46, May 3, 2014 (UTC)


Are we allowed to copy and paste their material? {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 19:19, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

The AFAS was cut/pasted and left alone. The source website has been included for reference. They are part of the Firefly universe. Syalantillesfel (talk) 19:25, May 3, 2014 (UTC)

White LightningEdit

It is from p60 of the "Six-Shooters & Spaceships" supplement to the game, rather than the TV series or film, therefore it DOES need the role-playing game label. {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 19:18, May 7, 2014 (UTC)

Six-Shooters & SpaceshipsEdit

Would it be worthwhile, given the number of entries and illustrations taken from it, to create this as a sub-category of 'Role-playing game', do you think? {{SUBST:User:Jiskran/Signature}} 19:33, May 7, 2014 (UTC)

No. Categories such as games are for the books and sources. The ships listed in those books are from the sources. They are not the sources. Syalantillesfel (talk) 19:35, May 7, 2014 (UTC)

Ship VolumeEdit

Why did you reverse my changes to the Union of Allied Planets Navy listing of ships by class? I am new, so I don't know if this discussion is appropriate to that page or to your private one, but I am going to start by talking to you directly. I appreciate the trivia that you have been adding to the Alliance Navy ships pages, and I honestly can't tell what changes you made today/yesterday (depending on time zone) to the AFAS and Ocula, but I want to know why you think the Alliance Landing Ship for Tanks is a medium ship. It is 750 tons, and the Alliance Patrol and Enforcement Cutter is 390 tons, putting both of them in the light transport/courier category. An Alliance Patrol Boat is 3,955 tons, and we both agree that it is a light ship at the size of a mid-bulk transport. Come to think of it, at 40 tons and 25 tons respectively, the Alliance Short Range Enforcement Vessel and Alliance Fast Attack Ship should probably be categorized as aircraft. Ditto the Alliance gunship as it is posted as being slightly larger than a standard shuttle. That would leave the Alliance Patrol and Enforcement Cutter and Alliance Patrol Boat as the only two ships in the light ship category, but as already noted, the Alliance Landing Ship for Tanks falls between them in tonnage, so it should be in that category as well--but when I fixed that, you undid that change. The smallest ship larger than the Alliance Patrol Boat is the Ocula-class Electronics Warfare Corvette at 48,000 tons, an order of magnitude larger, and we both agree it is properly placed in the medium ship category. Alongside it are the Victoria-class Corvette at 80,000 tons and the Trebuchet-class Battle Cruiser at 190,000 tons. Perhaps the Trebuchet-class Battle Cruiser should be classified as a heavy ship, but the Tohoku-class cruiser is 5.5 million tons and the Crete-class Carrier is 10 million tons. The Longbow-class Patrol Cruiser is 640,000 tons, putting it in the same weight category as the Trebuchet-class Battle Cruiser. I think the huge difference between them and the Tohoku-class cruiser and Crete-class Carrier merits them being classified as medium ships alongside the Victoria-class Corvette and Ocula-class Electronics Warfare Corvette. Regardless of whether they are classified as heavy or medium, the Trebuchet-class Battle Cruiser and Longbow-class Patrol Cruiser should, in my opinion, be in the same category, and the Alliance Landing Ship for Tanks is definitely not a medium ship, not at less than 1/5th the tonnage of an Alliance Patrol Boat and standard carry for a Crete-class Carrier along with Alliance Patrol and Enforcement Cutters, Alliance Short Range Enforcement Vessels, and Warhammer Interceptors. It is that change more than any other that you made that I simply cannot understand, and I would really appreciate hearing your reasoning behind putting the ships back the way they were. Thank you, and I hope to hear from you soon. Shen lewis (talk) 06:47, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

I am basing the list more on function. The light ships, such as the Alliance Short Range Enforcement Vessel are for police pursuit and customs, not dogfighting in a war zone. Where did you find the Tohoku mass? It is not on the Tohoku page. Syalantillesfel (talk) 07:27, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

Ship ListEdit

I'm currently writing a list of volume (not mass, common mistake), support craft, offensive weapons, and source in the talk section of the Navy entry. Give me a while to finish it, lol, but I can see putting the ASREV as a light ship instead of an aircraft; see "The Message". It was the ALST that really perplexed me, as noted, and I am pleased with the current entry. It seems like everything I edit, you edit the next day, and this is the first time I have been unhappy with your editing. I am very glad that we worked things out. Now let me get back to writing up the size of all the naval craft. Since it's technical trivia and a comparison, I'm putting it on the Navy page instead of 14 individual ship pages. ^_^ (To answer your question early, Tohoku-class is listed in Serenity RPG, pg. 128, under the bland title 'Alliance Cruiser', which lists it as 5.5 million tons and notes that it is the Tohoku-class). Hope that helps! ^_^

P.S. Thanks for adding a subject, "Ships". I didn't even realize I could edit my talks once published. I'm still learning, but I'm learning fast! I find that a good way to learn is to go into edit mode of a well-written entry to learn the code and then back out, but some things must be learned by experience. Thank you for helping me learn. ^_^ Shen lewis (talk) 07:37, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

Ship FunctionEdit

Before we start a re-arrangement disagreement, please read the below wiki sites. Real warships are being classed by function, as size is not reliable anymore. The alliance Battle Cruiser is lighter than the regular cruiser. Also, the corvettes have a 32,000 ton difference. Therefore, the tonnage and volume is less important that its role.

Syalantillesfel (talk) 07:56, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I'm aware of the difference between size and function. It's most inapplicable to capital ships; a destroyer is far more dangerous than a cruiser three times its size, but the cruiser is probably better at other thing besides ship-to-ship combat. Support craft is where size and functionality start to (usually) be directly related. Since none of the 'Aircraft' are atmospheric-only vessels, perhaps the page would be better served by changing that category to 'Support Craft', giving you heavy, medium, and light ships that can operate independently (for example, while an ASREV is *usually* found based off a larger ship, 'The Message' is proof that they can and do operate independently) and ships only found as support craft, some of which, like the Foxbat-class Fighter/Bomber, will be bigger than some of the light ships. As I've said before, my only major disagreement was the former classification of the ALST. Instead of starting a re-arrangement disagreement, why don't we find an arrangement that we both agree is sensible. We're the only two people editing that page, and we both agree that there is a problem with the current arrangement. I've noticed you, too, seem to be having some trouble deciding where to classify some of the ships other than the medium and heavy. So what do you think of splitting them into light and support craft? Again, to be clear, I want to talk things out until we come up with an idea we both think is good. ^_^ P.S. Do you have the unaired "Dead or Alive" script? I'm curious about the skiff. Shen lewis (talk) 10:47, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

Lol. I followed the yellow link road and found the script. Nevermind. Shen lewis (talk) 10:51, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

Supply ShipsEdit

Real life support ships are used as supply ships. The title of fighter/bomber is more accurate.

Syalantillesfel (talk) 11:10, May 19, 2014 (UTC)

Excellent point about support ships, they're only referred to that way in the RPG and other fan material, which isn't written by people with an eye towards accuracy with labels. I think we can both agree that 'Aircraft' is definitely not an accurate label, lol. Shen lewis (talk) 02:33, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

Crete versus TohokuEdit

Please review the source material. Which ship is larger, the Crete or the Tohoku?

Syalantillesfel (talk) 06:55, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

I do not know where the person who wrote the Crete-class carrier got that information. The description in the official source, Six-Shooters & Spaceships, says this: "The Crete-class carrier was designed as a replacement platform for the Tohoku-class cruiser. Its simplicity of design, greater speed, and longer tour duration make it a better answer for Alliance goals of law enforcement in the Rim. The greatest benefit over the Tohoku-class vessels is construction time and simplicity, allowing more to be made quickly. It is a mobile star port, with full repair facilities for vessels up to 4,000 tons to dry dock. It has sufficient capacity to hold all the mechanized equipment and support vessels for planetary actions, as well as a large number of ground forces. The transports stationed aboard the carrier can move these forces swiftly, while the enforcement vessels and interceptors have the power to defend ‘em. In addition to strictly military use, a number of these vessels are owned by mega-corps like Corone Mining Consortium—they are sometimes called “galleons.”"

I have seen no reference to the Crete being smaller than the Tohoku in the source material. The Tohoku-class is described in the Serenity RPG as 'a mobile essence, each Tohoku-class is a self-contained city in space' and is listed as 5.5 million tons, not even 5,500,000 tons, so it's not a typo, which would be easily conceivable given the deadline rush on the RPG. The Crete is described as 'a mobile star port'--not terribly helpful given that the Tohoku isn't described as being the size of a city. The Tohoku has 40,000 crew & passengers, while the Crete has 76,200 crew & passengers. We have only seen the Tohoku in Firefly and we have only seen the Crete (I believe there was exactly one at the Universe battle) in Serenity, but unlike the Tohoku, we never see the Crete in close proximity to Serenity, so we would have to do a size comparison through several Alliance ships at the Universe battle before coming to one that DID come in close proximity to Serenity. Worse, the Tohoku is not built in anything even remotely resembling a polyhedron; the Crete, at least, is close to a rectangular prism. Firefly & Serenity are not, therefore, a reliable way to compare the size of the two, so we must rely on the official source material--which states that the Crete is nearly twice as big and carries nearly twice as many people. Until Joss says otherwise, the Crete is bigger. I believe I'll go fix the Crete page now. Shen lewis (talk) 16:28, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

Code and TriviaEdit

Thanks for fixing the code on the source of the quote in the Universe Battle. I'm unfamiliar with the code, and am largely copying from other pages. Just wanted to say thank you, both for that, and for knowing where to strip material from the description and put it in the 'overview' section of ships, namely the Tohoku and Crete. Love your trivia, by the way! I thought about bringing up the fact that it acts like a carrier should, but felt uncomfortable altering the main body. Now I will remember to put real-life comparisons in the Trivia section, a lesson I should have learned from your excellent work on the AFAS. I am learning a great deal just from seeing how you change things, and I hope to soon be as proficient as you are. In the meantime, I'll do the grunt work and you keep on polishing. ^_^ Trivia: did you know that, if you compare the distances in the official map (to the RPG, but it has a great deal of science put into it, it's ARC 2.0 that came out of Verse in Numbers 2.0) to the numbers for travel time vs. communications lag in the RPG (pg. 105), and stick to the travel times (and if you don't, neither the show nor the movie make any sense), then communications in the Verse are only 1/3 the speed of light? Sorry, what? Did they forget about radio? Of course, if you stick to the travel times as written, and assume light-speed communications, then instead of being for a speed class of 1, they're for a speed class of 3...which is the speed of a Firefly. Hmm... Shen lewis (talk) 04:47, May 24, 2014 (UTC)


Sorry, I didn't notice that the 'Outlaws' page was up for deletion. I'll check next time! 

Agent Thresh (talk) 15:31, January 2, 2015 (UTC)


If you are going to delete the text, get rid of the Fenris pics. Ric Snead (talk) 23:49, March 22, 2015 (UTC)

Fellow EditingEdit

Thansk for all of your help with editing Linnix (talk) 15:30, September 26, 2016 (UTC)

Your welcome. Syalantillesfel (talk) 22:02, September 26, 2016 (UTC)

Adopting this wikiEdit

I put in a request a community central to adopt this wiki. I made a forum post and it has been asked that I contact you directly. Chalet (talk) 16:18, May 27, 2017 (UTC)

Hey Syalantillesfel,

Thanks for all the edits and adding categories! New to making Wikias and your edits have been real helpful.


On the Hades one though, I'll be changing that back to "Browncoat vigilantes" as the group is seperate to the Rust Devils. No offense meant, of course, still appreciate the edits and I hope you're enjoying reading the new lore from the books!

Aeonghus (talk) 09:26, March 20, 2019 (UTC)


Your grammar on the ocula page is bad and the information given is confusing you should fix it. or let someone else fix it.

Beamonde 19:00, November 11, 2019 (UTC)

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